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Pixel2019 , 10-26-2020, 02:37 PM

Dear Fedevel Academy and Mr. Rebert Fedevel,


I would like to use through whole via always in my 4 layer PCB. for example I want to connect layer 1 and 3 and 4 together with one VIA (Through hole Via). is that possible?
but as you can see in below picture, we can use only one through hole via between layer top and bottom only. Could you please help me?

I use Altium 2020 and I can not see stack up as below firgure . I can see in stack up just two layers! not inner 1 and inner 2 layer.
also in Altuim 2020 I could not find Drill pair manager.

Could you please help me how possibly I can create such through hole VIA?

Thank you so much for your Help.

robertferanec , 10-29-2020, 06:00 AM

That is ok. A through hole via can be used to connect any layers in your PCB. TOP and BOTTOM just specify where the VIA starts and where it stops. It can connect any layer between start and stop.

Pixel2019 , 10-29-2020, 12:31 PM

Dear Robert,

Could you please explain how to do what you explained? I can not create such via which connect layer 1 and 3 and 4. ofcourse, I can not connect ground plane and vcc layer with via.

Best Regards,

qdrives , 10-29-2020, 04:59 PM

Sorry Pixel2019 to posting here and I am not talking negative about you, but this really fits the question "where to start" in Roberts latest video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8TLB34p_qo

I have a feeling that you are "starting at the deep end" (swimming) and have skipped a few important steps. Basic layout (including via's) and a little more advanced layer stack manager. Also lacking basic Altium skills.
Do not think you can create a board from nothing within 100 hours (unless you have someone experienced next to you (physically)). It takes time. Study and learn.
I can imagine these may help: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2I2TX3RLEGM and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmD4EtEF2sQ

robertferanec , 11-02-2020, 05:44 AM

@Pixel2019, @qdrives doesn't mean it wrong. Just the question you are asking is very basic and it means, that before diving in, it could help you to have a look around to get more information. For example, what you are missing here is the process how PCB is manufactured.

When Through hole vias are manufactured, basically you take your PCB with multiple layers, they drill through the whole PCB and put copper inside of the hole (this process is called plating). And when you put copper inside a through hole via, this copper will connect any layer in your stackup. So, when you use a through hole via, you do not specify what layers you would like to connect, you just specify it goes from the TOP to the BOTTOM Layer.

Maybe have a look at these my videos, they can help:
- How is a multilayer PCB made? https://youtu.be/67WhV0EDqCA
- PCB Manufacturing - Important facts you should know: https://youtu.be/f6_svRNJYls

Also, try to google for some pictures of cross section of a through hole VIA, you can see how the copper inside of a via connects layers together:

Pixel2019 , 11-04-2020, 04:13 AM

Dear Robert,

Thank you for your response. I try to explain better.

You can see part of my design. I have more experience with PADS and l always did the vias like below picture in Altuim and I could set always which via could connect with which layer connected or isolated and I always used through vias.


Now, I can only make only one through Via in Altuim in from top to Bottom and not use through hole connected leyer1 and 3 connected .

I contact the manufacture to use through hole always, they said they must do it manually by themself BUT the other companies set that by themself.
so i do not know how to do that by myself in altuim. I want to use through whole always but I do not know how to connect or isolate it to the other layers.

Thank you for your response and help. 😄😅

You are the best.

goncaloc , 11-04-2020, 10:27 AM

Hi Pixel2019

In the via properties panel you can define the vias full stack and use it to define every layers pad for a specific via.
You also have the via /Pad Templates, for each different via and Pad used in a PCB a template is created, so you can have a different template for GND and VCC vias, you just place a new via and say you want to use this or that template

Hope that helped.

Pixel2019 , 11-04-2020, 10:53 AM

Dear Goncaloc,

Thank you so much for your response. my main problem is, I can see in Full stack only two layers, not 4 layers or middle layers. I think I must change something in Rules, to see it compeletly in Full stack. I can not do that. how can I see Full stack with 4 layer in via properties? something should be change in Rules?


Could you please help me? Thank you so much.

Best Regards, 🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏

goncaloc , 11-04-2020, 11:20 AM

I'm guessing you are using planes as internal layers, not sure if that is a bug but, when using planes you can not edit full stack.
If you change your internal layers to signal layers then you should see the vias full stack.

Pixel2019 , 11-04-2020, 11:25 AM

Dear Goncaloc,

Yes, I used internal layers for my mid layers. thank you so much. I will check it today at work.

Thanks & Best Regards,
Pixel

Pixel2019 , 11-05-2020, 02:34 AM

Dear Goncaloc and everyone,

I changed my layers to signal layers, but still I could not defined the throughput VIA correctly.
we have different places for VIA. like via tempelate or via preference but I do not know from which place I must define the tempelate. I just one throughput Via which connects the
layer 1 and 3 and isolated from layer 4 and etc....I can not create such thing.

Could you please help me from which place i must start to change the templete or via ?

goncaloc , 11-05-2020, 03:49 AM

Try like this
create a pad via library


then you create a new template


If I understand what you want correctly, you then change the size of the via pad ( make that 0mm ) on the layer you want o isolate

Pixel2019 , 11-05-2020, 04:04 AM

Dear Goncaloc,

Thank you so much for your reply. the main problem is I can again see only 2 layers in temeplete not 4 layers. but in via full stack in preferences or properperties, I can see 4 layers!!!!


Could you please help me?

Thank you so much

goncaloc , 11-05-2020, 05:04 AM

right click on the layers area and select add layer

robertferanec , 11-06-2020, 04:57 AM

@Pixel2019 I am not really sure why you are having so much problems with it. It just should work. Do not use full stackup, just "Simple" - that specifies the VIA parameters on ALL layers automatically.

Try this, Place a VIA (in menu go to Place -> VIA). Select the VIA, and have a look at the Properties panel if VIA Stack is set to Simple. Double check the Diameter and Hole size. If everything is set correctly you should be able to route from the VIA on any signal layer.

Pixel2019 , 11-12-2020, 03:28 AM

Dear Robert,

I tried to do what you said, but as you can see in below picture, it does not work out. I have error and the software is not contacting the via to the mid layer automatically.
also although I use Altuim Version 19.0.15, I can not see 3D Via stack in my VIA properties.

Could you please help me?

Best Regards,

robertferanec , 11-12-2020, 04:59 AM

And when you go into 3D model of the PCB? How does it look?

Pixel2019 , 11-12-2020, 06:14 AM

Dear Robert,

I do not see inner layers in the PCB but it sounds that the VIA is connected to all of 4 layers. I can not see inner layers very well. maybe reilef or direct should be selected for Via?

could you please let me know your opinion.

Pixel2019 , 11-12-2020, 07:32 AM

Dear Robert,

robertferanec , 11-13-2020, 04:22 AM

That is awesome!